Julie Sherman Wolfe: Behind the Magic of A Holiday Spectacular

On this special episode of Pour The Wine, It’s Rom-Com Time, Garry and Amy are joined by Rich and Rene from the Forever Hallmark Christmas podcast to welcome acclaimed Hallmark screenwriter Julie Sherman Wolfe. Together, they explore Julie’s journey from stand-up comedy to sitcom writing and ultimately to becoming one of Hallmark’s most celebrated storytellers. Julie shares why Hallmark’s signature style of storytelling became such a natural fit for her voice and how she crafts G-rated romances that feel authentic and emotionally resonant.

The conversation then turns to Hallmark's A Holiday Spectacular, as Julie takes listeners behind the scenes of the 2022 holiday film. They discuss the movie’s origins, its richly detailed 1958 setting, the sisterhood at the heart of the Rockettes, Radio City Music Hall, and the story’s theme of a young woman pursuing her dreams while challenging the expectations placed upon her. It's a fascinating look at the creative process behind one of Hallmark's most memorable Christmas movies.

Pour yourself a glass, get cozy, and press play! This is one you don’t want to miss! Cheers!

Follow Rich & Rene: http://www.instagram.com/foreverhallmarkchristmas

Follow Julie: www.instagram.com/julie_sherman_wolfe

Send us an email to pourthewineitsromcomtime@gmail.com! We'd love to hear your thoughts!

Music from #Uppbeat

https://uppbeat.io/t/abbynoise/mood-of-summer

Transcript

Welcome And Special Guests

SPEAKER_01 0:07

Welcome to For the Wine. It's rom-com time, where we'll sip some wine and review all things rom com on the Hallmark channel. I'm Amy.

SPEAKER_03 0:15

And I'm Gary.

SPEAKER_01 0:17

And we have some very special guests joining us today. We originally reached out to Rich and Renee, the co-hosts of the Forever Hallmark Christmas podcast, about collaborating on a review of a Christmas movie, and we landed on a holiday spectacular to review. Now, Rich and Renee have a really cool segment on their podcast where they share fun, behind-the-scenes facts, sometimes even from the creatives behind the scenes. When they started reaching out to a few people connected to a holiday spectacular, one thing led to another. And what began as a simple crossover idea has turned into something even more special. So today we're beyond thrilled to not only be joined by the Forever Hallmark Christmas podcast Rich and Renee, but also by the writer of a holiday spectacular, Julie Sherman Wolf. So welcome everyone. We're so happy you're here. Thanks for having me. This is fun. And with that, I will hand it over to Rich to formally introduce Julie.

SPEAKER_04 1:20

If you're a Hallmark fan, you probably don't need much introduction. But uh so I originally reached out to John Putch, who had directed the film, and he was so forthcoming with information. He just wanted to tell me everything and anything about the production itself, how it all came together, uh, the filming and Radio City music hall. Sent me a big old list. Anything more you need to know, or just let me know. He was so happy talking about. Then he hit me, Rich, you need to contact Julie and talk to Julie. I said, Ooh, I don't know if I'm quite ready for that. Which is kind of funny because we'd we'd corresponded with Ron Oliver and Marcomato and uh and Janet King, other Hallmark writers. And I go, but this is Julie Sherman Wolfe, who's written literally some of my favorite Hallmark Christmas movies. And then I go, I don't know, I don't know about this, John. He goes, I insist you I want you to name drop me in the very first sentence. And uh Julie got back to me. Yeah, he's great. And then Julie got back to me the next day and said, Hey, tell me all about it. I'd love to join you guys. And and here she is. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

And it was so nice. Well, Rich Rich kept sending us updates. He's like, You're never gonna believe this. Never gonna believe what John said. You're never gonna believe Julie's on board. And we were so excited.

SPEAKER_00 2:31

And then and then we had a clear, we had to make sure like Hallmark was fine, like spilling, spilling the tea edible. Not too much tea, really, but just you know, we like to make sure everybody's happy. Yeah, yeah. The people who hire me for things.

SPEAKER_01 2:44

We want you to keep working there, Julie. It's fine. It's fine. All right.

How Julie Found Screenwriting

SPEAKER_01 2:50

So, Julie, let's get into your relationship with Hallmark. How did that get started? And what was it about that style of storytelling that really clicked for you as a writer?

SPEAKER_00 3:00

So well, I started in sitcoms. So I was um I was doing stand-up. This is I'm gonna tell the longest story as shortly as short as I can. No, you're good. I was in San Diego. I was uh I graduated from UCSD, a school I could never get into now, ever. The way it's so it's so huge now. I went there, I was gonna, I was gonna do, I was a writer, a writer, just a normal writer. And then when you don't live in LA or if you don't know anyone in the industry, you don't think about being a screenwriter. It does not even cross your mind because there's no internet, there's no little, I mean, there was internet, but barely like it there just wasn't a way to sort of become part of that world if you didn't already know it existed. It just never occurred to me. So I was doing advertising, copywriting, um, just living in San Diego, hanging out, doing that. Um, one day I got laid off, I got downsized from the ad agency, and then I also got dumped up by my boyfriend of three years the same day. I had stand-up, I had a stand-up slot that night at like 11:30, you know, big headline spot, 11:30 p.m. Um so I went, I'm like, I don't do I really want to do this. I don't feel very funny. I'm like, you know what? I'm going. I'm just gonna do it. I went, I met Rich Scheidner, who used to be a big, big stand-up, and he was a writer on Roseanne, and we were talking. He's like, well, let me get this straight. This is what he says like, well, you're funny and you're a chick. So why aren't you in LA writing sitcoms? You would get hired in a second, and then you could probably do that. And it was just that moment of like, oh my god, that's what I totally should be doing. I'd never, it literally did not occur to me until that moment. And I six months I saved some money, waited table, six months later, moved to LA, lived in the hood. Um my neighbors, my neighbors were ladies of the night and their pimps. Um interesting lives, right? You know, I like I had it right there, right there to the taking. Um, I had options, and then um, so I did sitcoms for uh a long time, and then um and I did a little animation and I started kind of doing Disney Channel, sort of young adult sitcoms and stuff like that. But comedy was always my thing, but I always really, really loved the romantic comedy genre. I worked at a movie theater of the same summer that when Harry Met Sally came out and just loved that medium, but again, never thought about writing that way. Um, when we had the very first writer's strike, I think it was 2007 now, I don't remember. Oh seven, oh eight somewhere. Um, that's when I started kind of transitioning and I I had a minute to work on something, and I had done a couple of TV movies. I did a Disney Channel one that was not a romantic comedy, but it was a TV movie. And I did, and then I did one for Lifetime that was an outlandish plot of a woman who marries herself called I Me Wed. And um, that was my first rom-com sale. But I just had that time to write, to write that long form comedy, rom romantic comedy, and I just loved it. And I and I really felt like it was easier for me because I just love it so much. And I had all my favorite movies returned, you know, were rom coms, really. So after kind of getting my foot in the door with the Lifetime movie and um the Disney Channel movie, which won an award, um, it still took me a good five years to get into Hallmark.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

And I tried a bunch of I tried a bunch of times and a bunch of pitches and it wasn't working. And I finally got one in. It was Hello It's Me, um, I guess 2013-ish, somewhere like that. And um that one, you know, thankfully did well and they and people really liked it, and that just sort of kept me going there. And I was, you know, happy to do nothing but that. Yeah, basically. Um and and I just I I still like comedy, but I feel like I get to do that within this, within what I'm writing, you know, and I really try to make I try to make it entertaining, and it doesn't because you know, drama is kind of easier. Writing just, you know, I can make you cry so much easier than than laugh. It's just you know, so but I I just I just love it so much, and I'm happy that I can I can't believe I'm still getting to do it this many years later. I'm just very grateful for that. And then I got in there when I did, right, right when it was getting to be the zeitgeist, the cultural zeitgeist that it has become. I got in right when that was starting to happen.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

So wow.

SPEAKER_00 7:17

Yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

That's just that's incredible. I mean, what do you think of it? Do you ever um have any contact with that ex-boyfriend and say, look at me now?

SPEAKER_02 7:26

Drop the mic. Actually, yo, how are you doing?

SPEAKER_00 7:32

I was in Vegas um and I saw him bartending at like a bar at a hotel in Vegas, and and I was there for something fabulous. I don't remember what it was, but it was very, you know, it was very much that. And I, you know what I actually sort of just felt like, okay, you know, it's fine. Because like I'm married now to the right person, you know. So it doesn't, it didn't, I was already with him when I saw him, so I didn't feel like, you know, I didn't feel like being petty about it, but right, right. It's just interesting. Inwardly, I would be like, that that person, you know, how am I gonna do any better? Am I gonna find anybody else? And that that goes into what I write all the time. But like you always think at that moment, like, well, that was it, it's over. I'm never gonna.

SPEAKER_05 8:16

How is this not a already a Hallmark movie? This right.

SPEAKER_00 8:21

This premise on screen. That's right. Yeah. So I mean, and then of course you look back and be like, oh my God, what was I thinking? Yeah. You want every I want everyone in the world to basically have a moment of finding the right person and looking back and thinking, what was I thinking? You know, with without making the ex-boyfriend, you know, we can't make him too awful because then it reflects upon the care the main character. We're always careful about that. The ex-boyfriend cannot be the worst person in the world, or else why would or else why would she be with him and why would we care for her if she has taste? You know, right. Excuse me.

SPEAKER_04 8:59

So when you started writing these these rom-coms, you mentioned when Harry met Sally and all these old rom coms from the 80s and 90s you used to loved. Did you kind of find inspiration from the Nora Efrons and Nancy Myers of the world? Or do you kind of just create or did you just do or do you just blaze your own style and said, No, I'm gonna kind of do my thing?

SPEAKER_00 9:16

And it's like I I the just the genre is was was them, right? Right when I was, you know, the peak a the peak person for the as that audience, you know, with all the Nora Ephron stuff and her and Sally, but I also love pillow talk and all kind of the old time Philadelphia story and all the stuff that came up beforehand. Because the thing about Hallmark is, you know, you can't write, you can't write a sex scene, you can't write too much. Uh it's rated G. So you're almost depending on the the banter and the the word play of the old style movies uh more than you would on Oh when Harry Met Sally, because we had, you know, they all had they all had a little more freedom as far as what they could say and do.

SPEAKER_02 9:57

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:58

It's it's actually a challenge and it's fun to you to really show romance and people falling in love without getting it past the rated G level. And that's what they used to do. So I find those really informative to always keep watching every so often and just remember that that's all it's all about that banter, that His Girl Friday, that Philadelphia story, all that stuff. Um Pillow Talk is my kind of well, Pillow Talk and then um singing in the rain, you can you can kind of call a rom-com, but not really, but it's sort of, but that's one of my favorite movies. Um so yeah, that's that's but I had my style is very I mean, you definitely I definitely have a style for Hallmark. It's just kind of uh fast and a little snarky, probably, if you asked anybody.

SPEAKER_03 10:42

Um well, the majority of my favorite movies were written by you, so is that right?

SPEAKER_01 10:49

When we looked at your list, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:53

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

I mean, yeah, we have a debate with uh Rich and Renee about Tyler Hines' best performance, and we actually think it was in Always a Moray, which we just adored.

SPEAKER_04 11:04

Sorry, it's an unexpected Christmas.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

Uh Julian all but in a boy. But that's okay, that's okay. It's just good banter.

SPEAKER_00 11:11

I think that uh Paul had a concussion for a good portion of that shoot. So you can rewatch Always a Morey and look try and find the fun scenes where not Paul, I mean uh sorry, Tyler. Tyler had a concussion. Tyler, oh really? He didn't. At some point during that shoot, yes, I found out many. Unexpected fun facts. Yeah, there you go. There you go. That was like I I haven't watched it since I knew found that out, but I I bet you could watch it and try and say, like, oh yeah, you try to see. Yeah. He's a lovely, lovely person. I uh really loved working with him.

SPEAKER_01 11:44

Yeah, he seems so great. And uh, what movie number was that for him? Was he maybe oh man, it was early, pretty was it fairly early for him?

SPEAKER_04 11:53

I was a more I'm not sure. 2017 was his was his Christmas Eve, and that was his first one he'd ever written. His first one. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:02

So a few years ago. I know they all blend. All right, so let's get into a holiday spectacular.

Rom-Com Influences And Writing Clean

SPEAKER_01 12:10

It originally aired on the Hallmark channel on November 27th, 2022, and stars Gina Claire Mason and Derek Clenna. And of course, I'd be remiss if I didn't mention that the iconic Anne Margaret is also in it. You can find the extended cut right now streaming on Hallmark Plus.

SPEAKER_03 12:28

Yep, and it was directed by John Butch and written by our lovely guest, Julie Sharon.

SPEAKER_01 12:35

Set in 1958. It follows Maggie, who sneaks up to New York City to make her secret dream come true, dancing live on stage in the Christmas spectacular at Radio City Music Hall, putting her high society wedding plans on hold. And now we will turn it over to Rich for some fun facts about the movie.

SPEAKER_04 12:55

Yeah, so uh a lot of these came from uh John Putch. Some came from I saw some interviews that Jenna Claire Mason did uh uh after the filming. So, Julie, you can fact-check me on any of these things you want to, or kind of maybe chime in with your own thoughts. But I know the filming took place in January and February of 2022, right after I believe the Rockets 2021 season ended, because a lot of the Rockets uh were still around and uh took uh part in the movie. Um, I know it was filmed inside Radio City music hall. I think John said you guys had about three days of filming at Radio City.

SPEAKER_00 13:27

Unbelievable. It was it was surreal to be standing there and looking out.

SPEAKER_04 13:31

And yeah, yeah, I think that's one of the reasons the movie feels so authentic and you had those like 1950 Chevies right in front of Radio City.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

Yes, it was amazing. Those are my favorite pictures of the ones of standing outside with all those cars with the in the with the name of the well, I'll I'll get into that in a second.

SPEAKER_04 13:50

But I know it, I believe you were there, Julie. There was a movie premiere that 200 Rockettes showed up for uh that Hallmark put on. Tell us about that.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

That was a crazy night because it was the first movie premiere at Radio City in 40 years, I think. And um, I I'm one of these weird people who I don't live in the moment. I have a lot of trouble remembering things after they happen. So I'm having a great time in the night. It's I think it's an ADHD thing, if I from what I could tell. But I just I do remember pulling up and just like walking up and seeing, so it was the name of the it was the holiday spectacular on the marquee and just being I I don't even know. I was just overwhelmed, it was just overwhelming. And then then the Roquets all did their thing, and then Kristen Shenowith came out. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Did a performance for the that maybe thousand people who were there, and then I'm like, and I said to my husband, if she because Jenna Claire was um on was Glinda on Broadway in the more recent, like right before this movie, and obviously Kristen Shenowith, you know, originated the role. We had, I mean, we had so much, we can talk about the Broadway insanity of our cast in a second because like Derek and and Jenna Claire and everybody, but um she I said to my husband, if she and and uh Kristen Chenowith sing for good, I'm going to lose it. I'm going to lose it. And they did. And I was just bawling. I mean, it was just beautiful because Jenna Claire ended up singing um Alphabet's part.

SPEAKER_04 15:25

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 15:26

But she knows it. I mean, it's not like she didn't know the the harmonies and all that stuff, but it was just like that's a thing where I have to watch it on my video that I have of it because I can't even remember the moment because I was just like, you know, you know, ugly crying, just standing there.

SPEAKER_04 15:39

I was just I was just gonna ask, is there a video of it? And if so, we need to see it. So there is, there is.

SPEAKER_00 15:44

I'm not sure why I'm allowed to even share it because it's like private, you know, thing. And it was just crazy. I could not, I couldn't believe that that happened. It was it was an amazing night. And then that night after the after party, I was hanging out with um uh Ashley Williams, and we and then she's like it was like two in the morning, and she's like, Oh, I have a kind of an idea for a movie, and we started talking about it. I'm like, this is great. Then we ended up bringing Allie Sweeney in, and like and then he was selling that idea for that was born that night, and that became the two Barcelona movies.

SPEAKER_01 16:16

Oh my gosh, how cool. What a great night that turned out to be. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_04 16:24

Another two movies I loved.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

Yep. Who did you? Oh, thank you. Thank you, thank you. I love that. I did I did get to go, I did fly out for that for a couple days with you know, for I had no reason to be there. They were I you know the script was written, but it was a good excuse to go to they were they were doing a podcast during that, right?

SPEAKER_03 16:41

During that shoot. Yeah, yeah, I think so.

SPEAKER_00 16:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Again, don't remember anything except my picture. I'm sorry, I'm glad Renee's nodding, like, yes, I understand. I do understand. It's so bad.

SPEAKER_03 16:56

Look, I'm right there with you.

SPEAKER_04 16:58

So we met we mentioned Anna Margaret and we also had Eve Plum for uh Jam for the Brady Bunch. I mean, are you are you kidding me?

SPEAKER_00 17:06

It's I know that picture for me, one of some of my favorite pictures is me and Jan Brady. And just it was just like, yeah, the whole thing, and now now Derek is a Savannah banana, and he's really he is killing it. He is doing he's basically singing Broadway numbers every single night and then pitching. It's called he pitched Division I, UCLA. He was a pitcher. And they brought him in, and this it's like, I I I didn't want to text, I didn't want to bother him because I'm sure everyone's asking for tickets because you can't even get tickets to this. But um, I was like, I this is so perfect. This is the most perfect thing I've ever seen. And he you can see him on YouTube, but he just he's just killing all these songs and doing all these amazing performances every single time he goes out there.

SPEAKER_04 17:52

Wow. He literally walks out, he's he's singing a song, he's got all of his other players as backup dancers behind him. Next thing you know, they throw him a myth, throw him a ball, and he's pitching the first inning of a baseball game. It's crazy. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

Yeah, I mean we have to go to one. We haven't been to it, it's such a great concept.

SPEAKER_00 18:06

Yeah, I am dying to go.

SPEAKER_03 18:07

It's like the Holland Go Trotters in basketball in baseball.

SPEAKER_00 18:12

I just I'm dying to go. I just, you know, I'm not gonna like I know Derek and I, you know, talked to him a few times, but I wouldn't. That's not we're not close enough for me to I don't think I'm just listening to the difference to. I don't think I want. Oh wow. You never know.

SPEAKER_03 18:26

You never know until you ask, right?

SPEAKER_04 18:28

That's right. So John Putch reminded me of something when I mentioned Eve Plum. So John Putch was a child actor of the 70s and 80s, as was Eve Plum. So they used to do on go to auditions together and practice reading together back then. So they go way back, you know, 40 plus years.

SPEAKER_00 18:43

Uh John, I'm telling, like, I wish uh I wish he was on here. He is so great. He turned, I mean, he made it look like a 40-50 million dollar production. I thought he it just looked so good. It was just so well done. I'm so glad the extended release is still out because a lot he a lot of the really beautiful stuff that he did got cut for time. Oh so um now that's all back out there, which is great. It's a visually stunning movie.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

I mean, yeah, it's amazing. Start to finish. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 19:11

Hallmark Plus, I couldn't even find the regular version. All I could find was the extended. So I didn't realize I was watching an extended release. I just, you know, I just click on until afterwards, like, oh, this is the extended, as I'm so glad I'm never gonna want to watch the regular one, which is why I have all these beautiful shots, and I'm sure it's a good one.

SPEAKER_00 19:27

And I gotta thank my cousin Jonathan because if it wasn't for my cousin who was a dancer, uh we that none of this movie would have happened at all because he was the one that was really close with the head of Madison Square Garden Entertainment. And he is the one that got me that first meeting of just to connect me and the Roquettes in general. And then I said, Hey, um, Hallmark, hi. Uh do you guys want to meet with the Roquettes? Because I have this meeting with the Rockettes that you must go. That's funny because it worked out pretty well.

SPEAKER_03 19:57

That that was gonna be my question is when when the project first started, how much of the concept was already there? And it was really sand.

SPEAKER_00 20:06

It was a meeting of we went into we went to I I literally I'm I'm in Connecticut. I took the trains right right to Penn Station, and their offices are right there by the you know by the garden. And I just said we didn't really have the concept, we just had the meeting of just saying we want to do something, we we think we want it to be a period piece, right? Um, and then just sort of really loosely talked about sort of some of the parameters that we would think about. And then I just kind of came up with a couple of different takes on what that might look like. Um and uh it's a little a little homage to Philadelphia's story. Um and just just trying to find a way that you know was back in time, but also kind of had a modern sensibility. So that's that's what we were trying to kind of hit. It was but I kind of no, um everyone was so into it, and Samantha DePippo was the executive, and we worked really closely together on that and and just trying to really make sure it was the best story that it could be before we even started writing this tell the teleplay, but then had to go through approvals from a lot of different people just to get to the actual writing of the script because there's a lot of you know, a lot of people needed to approve and be involved, and it's is much more than a normal movie, kind of like the way it was with the Chiefs movie. Kind of kind of the same same thing, like so many more, so many more people involved.

SPEAKER_03 21:32

Wow, that's it. That's really interesting.

SPEAKER_04 21:35

So another fun fact here, I I I heard that I heard an interview with Jenna Claire. So Maggie's parents in the movie, actors Byron Jennings and Carolyn McCormick, they're a real life couple, they're married in real life. Oh wow, and I didn't know that until she mentioned that.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

Uh I didn't either. That's so brilliant. That's so sweet. I love that.

SPEAKER_04 21:53

And I heard an interesting interview with the uh Keith Nielsener, the costumes. Uh he was doing A podcast, and he estimated that at first he said, I think we did about a thousand costumes, and he goes, You know what? It might have been closer to two thousand. Uh because you when you think about the orchestra, everybody sitting out in the audience, uh, the department store, the diner scenes. He says they were doing like 75 fittings a day. Wow. Uh so it was just amazing. And I'm sure to be able to do a period piece like this is probably just a dream for uh for a costume guy like that, just to be doing something so different because when he'd been working with Hallmark, so much of a set in the present day, but to go back and do an entire movie that was almost what 98% from 1958.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

So the gown that he made that he had for her at the end. It was just it was all just beautiful. Yeah. Oh well.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

Gosh, the red hat, the red coat, the red gloves, the red furs. I mean, I loved all the cosmic.

unknown 22:47

It was great.

SPEAKER_02 22:49

So so good.

unknown 22:50

All right.

SPEAKER_04 22:50

So some of the information John Putch gave me uh specifically, I said he gave me a whole bunch and he just wanted to give me more, but I said, okay, John, I think I got enough here. But he talked about the the scene where where Jenna Claire and the other girls, Maggie, walk into Radio City for the first time in the back, and it does that shot of them all the way looking back all the way to the stage. And they let him fly a drone inside Radio City music hall. He said he was so excited to do that. I think we all were talking before he came on Julie.

SPEAKER_03 23:16

That one visual is just so impressive of Radio City.

SPEAKER_04 23:20

I was there for that.

SPEAKER_00 23:21

I was there for that shot. It was just, yeah, it was gorgeous. And it turned out better than even in I would ever picture it in my head. And that's the thing. Like as a writer, you know, you can put stuff in the stage direction and you can have it, you can picture it in your head. And it some you know, it doesn't always go down the way you picture it in your head, but sometimes you get really lucky and it's better than you pictured it in your head. And and for when it's John, it's always better than you pictured.

unknown 23:46

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 23:47

That's just that's it, it just was beautiful. Yeah, yeah, I love it.

SPEAKER_03 23:50

It really was. It really was.

SPEAKER_04 23:52

And you talked a lot about working with Radio City Music Hall, how good they were to work with. But Radio City Music Hall had their own crew, and Hallmark had their own crew, and the two had to work together, just as there were a few little growing pains at first, but they uh got all together and in the end, uh it was pretty seamless, and they were able to work together for those three days and and make it all work out.

A Holiday Spectacular Setup

SPEAKER_00 24:10

I was just hanging out, so I didn't hear about that part. I was just like, how am I gonna get my picture with the rocket? Let's make sure I get my picture with the rockets. And I didn't even get the one, I did not get a picture of me and all the rockets in a line because uh when it was my turn for the picture, it was time to start shooting again. So I actually have that photo. I have me and like a few of them in a selfie. Um, you know, I had a picture with Ann Margaret, which is which she signed. I I sent to her assistant who signed it and sent it back to me. So I have that, and I love that. And um, like you know, just it was fun to just kind of hang out and get to know some of the the actors and some of and that's kind of what I love. I love going to set just to talk to people and um without hopefully not bothering anybody. Um, I did get to do this, it doesn't happen all the time. I actually did have to write a little bit. Um, we were running long on something, I can't remember what it was, but I definitely had to kind of condense a scene in in the Radio City shoot where where I actually felt useful. And I am like, okay, see, it was good that I came. Because you could re rewrite it.

SPEAKER_05 25:15

I want to know if you stood on the stage and at least tried to do one of those kicks. I think that's what I would do.

SPEAKER_00 25:22

I stood on the stage. I actually did stand there and I did look out at the thing, and so I did get to stand there, but I thought I thought in my mind, I thought if I do a kick, it's too cliche, and that's what everybody does. So I didn't do it.

SPEAKER_02 25:33

Oh I didn't do it, I didn't do it.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

And also, um, I probably would have broken or twisted something at that point.

SPEAKER_04 25:42

Uh I'm assuming this one is true, but Julie can confirm the original working title was Spectacular Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 25:48

That's true. And I still can't remember what the name of the movie is. If you if you put a gun to my head and said, What's the name of the movie? I would say Spectacular Christmas.

SPEAKER_01 26:04

Yeah. So does it run with that first name until it almost air? At what point did they change?

SPEAKER_00 26:10

When did they change it? Yeah, I think they changed it um sometime at some point after they shot it. I I don't remember.

SPEAKER_03 26:18

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 26:18

Um even like the bar, you know, the movies always change them. Sometimes they'll get one through all the way, which is great. Um but Barcel, like the Barcelona movies were those were changed, and uh, I'm just trying to think of the more recent ones. The Chiefs one was a secret name the whole time, so it never even had a title until they decided to call it that. Um, and now I can't remember any any other movie I've ever written. So I I've said before the once they're done, they're done. It's out, they're gone.

SPEAKER_05 26:49

They're gone. I I get your brain. Yeah, I get it.

SPEAKER_00 26:51

Yeah, they made room for the new thing.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

That's right.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

That's right. You move on.

SPEAKER_04 26:57

So I've said I've said that Jenna Claire's become my favorite whole mark actress. I think she kills it in every movie she's in. But John reminded me, this was the first time she'd ever done like a television movie. She'd only ever been on stage before. Um, and that she kind of had to learn filming bits and pieces. Yeah. And but it's completely different acting.

SPEAKER_00 27:15

I can't even begin to describe it's like me trying to write a horror mystery. Like it's not the same. It's it's a completely, completely different technique. Because when you're on stage, you're projecting, you're over-emoting your your when you're doing a musical like that. And this is all quiet, subtle, you know, it's so different. I'm so impressed that she did. I mean, obviously, I'm sure she had other training besides musicals, but just the fact that she could just snap in and and do it like that was pretty amazing. It's great.

SPEAKER_04 27:41

And Derek had done a little bit of TV, but uh, you know, the two of them ended up being a fantastic combination. I have more casting questions I want to ask you a little bit later.

SPEAKER_00 27:48

Well, the fact that none of them were singing isn't so my my fun my fun claim to fame is I've had so more Broadway people in my movies than anybody else, and they never sing. I've had every I've had One Royal Holiday, which is one of my favorite movies that I've done. So good. Had it was it was before Broadway opened back up after COVID. So we had Victoria Clark, you know, and we had Laura Osnes, and we had Aaron Tavate, and we had Tom McGowan, and we had like it's just it was just like this list of people, and they they sang for like five seconds uh Christmas Carol, you know, and so Jeremy Jordan had an art movie.

SPEAKER_04 28:26

Jeremy Jordan in Hawking Riot.

SPEAKER_00 28:30

I love him. Man, sad.

SPEAKER_04 28:33

Um, he also mentioned, and I don't know how much time you go on with Anne Margaret, but he said she was very nervous, but a complete sweetheart. She just really wanted

Filming At Radio City Music Hall

SPEAKER_04 28:40

to do well.

SPEAKER_00 28:41

Yeah, she was very quiet, very, very sweet, though.

SPEAKER_04 28:44

I mean, this is somebody that was opposite Elvis in in Viva Las Vegas. I mean, once upon a time, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 28:50

Yeah, no, I think she's I still come across that video where she's dancing. That's amazing video. Yeah, it's a great video.

SPEAKER_00 28:57

She's just probably she's done a lot in her life. She's just like, you know what? I'm just gonna hang, I'm just gonna sit here and I couldn't believe I could not believe we got her for this. It was crazy. How did that how did that end up going? No idea. No idea. I have no clue. I probably actually honestly, it was probably John Putch because he knows everybody, he has connections, he if he knows who he wants, he he can usually find a way to get it. He goes after it, eh? I I feel like it was him. If I if you know, that's like a vague little blip in my memory that I think it might have been him. So let's just let's just give him credit for it. Okay, we'll give him props for them.

SPEAKER_03 29:31

Super funny.

SPEAKER_04 29:32

And then a little hallmark magic. My last one here is a little bit the the shooting locations John told me about. So the I guess only three days were filmed in Manhattan at Radio City Music Hall. Uh, one day over in Brooklyn, and then the rest was pretty much shot uh up in upstate Albany, um, Kingston, Poughkeepsie. Uh so yeah, uh about four days kind of in in, I guess you would say New York proper there between Brooklyn and and Manhattan, and the rest uh was upstate.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

It was pretty interesting. I have a great picture. It's one of my favorite ones where they it was one of those NYPD signs where they literally closed down the street in front of Radio City and had the movie on it. And I was just, you know, who gets that either? Who gets the right street to film? And then the tourists are taking pictures, and I was just like, I don't get I don't get I don't get starstruck, and I don't get too this all this whole thing was just overwhelmingly amazing and exciting, and I was definitely just in shock that it was happening. I mean, you know, it was just it was great. I had it wow. Now I never thought I would have a bigger movie to happen than that, but I guess the Chiefs one ended up being even bigger than that. Well, that was yeah, that was pretty big.

SPEAKER_01 30:40

Pretty, pretty big too.

SPEAKER_00 30:41

I didn't get to go to set. I didn't go to set for that one. So really Radio City still remains number one in my set visit thing. Yeah. Yeah, it didn't work out for that to get to Kansas City at that exact day. But I heard it was miserably hot, so it probably was the best. That movie cracked me up. It was so good.

SPEAKER_05 31:00

I really enjoyed it. It really was.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Funny one.

SPEAKER_04 31:03

Yeah, yeah, because so many Hallmark movies are filmed in the summer for the Christmas season, but this one was was in the cold in January and February. So this one was, yeah. It had to be really cold upstate that time, uh time of year, I'm sure. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:15

Yeah, it was it was cold. And it was um, you know, it's funny because I always think of things of COVID or not COVID, you know, it's like a lot of my members at this shoot are, you know, having to take tests before you could get on set. And you know, there's a whole guy whose job was coordinating COVID tests and all that stuff. And man. Um they looked a little different then because my three movies around COVID were that this one, One Royal Holiday, and Wedding Every Weekend. And you can see in all the movies where there's like a little more space between people and there's not quite as many extras and all that stuff. So um, I'm glad that's over. Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 31:50

We all are.

SPEAKER_00 31:51

Yeah. For sure.

SPEAKER_01 31:53

All right, Rich, does that wrap up the fun facts? That are the fun facts. Thanks for Julie for confirming.

SPEAKER_04 31:58

Uh I think we I think we had them all right there.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Yeah, excellent, excellent.

SPEAKER_03 32:03

All right. So, Rich, you your question is up next.

SPEAKER_04 32:06

Oh, I get the next one. Okay, well, I guess this kind of goes into a little bit. Julie's already talking started talking about the process of writing it. I'm just kind of curious how long it took from the time you basically started whether it'd be an outline or whatever, till literally the final draft was done. I mean, how long are we talking here?

SPEAKER_00 32:22

Wow, that's a really good question. I could look on my phone, but you'd have to cut this.

SPEAKER_04 32:27

I mean, are are we talking months, a year? I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 32:30

Um, I you know, I think um I think it was a few months. I mean, it's just it's really not about the writing process from on my end. It's about the kind of the waiting for approval to move on to the next phase. Okay. Um, I wouldn't say, I mean, I would say that the you know, it went through the normal amount of drafts and the normal amount of notes. Um, and you know, luckily everyone seemed to be on board with what we were doing. And, you know, obviously the changes are made. Um, it was definitely too long because there were so many people in this movie. There were so many side, you know, side quests and and and subplots and stuff like that. And, you know, it it always made me sad to have to cut any of those because they all felt really interesting and important to me. Um, so it was definitely long. So that was sort of one of the things that took a little bit, you know, longer to get through was to sort of just try and trim this into something manageable. Um, but the reason there's an extended cut is because even then it was still too long. Um but generally, you know, it doesn't take it takes me, it just depends how it's flowing, you know. Like I have a, you know, I have a page count I like to meet every single day. Um, and I try and I try and get through that. And I normally do kind of the fast draft, the vomit draft first, and try and get everything that's in my head out there. And then I like to kind of go back in and start really writing and fine-tuning. It's more fun for me that way. Um but yeah, it didn't take any longer than normal, you know, um probably probably a couple months to write the actual teleplay, and probably a couple months, maybe a little more for the outline because that's the part everyone was approving.

unknown 34:00

Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:00

Um, I always find the outline actually to be more difficult because that's where you're really getting into the nitty-gritty of the story. Like I know the dialogue's the dialogue, and that's to me, that's the fun part. But it's just making sure everyone's character arcs are making sense and everybody's, you know, everyone's taken care of and everything's at the right place at the right time. Um, that's the harder. You have to cut that's where you're coming up with all the you know, the meat of it. Teleplay part is the fun part in my mind.

SPEAKER_04 34:27

Was Hallmark more involved in the story than a normal movie might be doing seeing her?

SPEAKER_00 34:33

Um, they're always involved. I mean, they're always highly involved in the story. I would say more, yes, more this time because it was such a high-stakes project that everybody needed to be fully. I I don't know, you know, I don't know what happens behind the scenes, but I just know that there are more people reading every draft and reading everything that comes in and making sure you you're getting more notes from more people. But the, you know, when you have a good executive, um, that person will kind of condense everything into one into one thing and give it to you like that. So it's not like you're getting 10 phone calls, you're getting one phone call with you know, where Samantha would sort of just distill all the notes down into one document for me, and we would talk about them, and then we would sort of talk out whatever if there was never kind of a question or anything like that. So it's you know so I have my one point person, and she was the one sort of dealing with all the madness and craziness and chaos, and just left me to do what I was doing. So, and then I generally like to stay with the project all the way through production. Um, if I if if I'm close enough with the producers or the director, where if there's a couple lines that need changing, I would rather do it myself than have somebody else put it in last second because I you can kind of tell the difference in voice, you know. So I was so I was able to do that too, which is great.

SPEAKER_05 35:55

I had a question more about sort of the story. I'm sorry, I have to kind of read it because I'm not in the best with memory. But what I wrote down was that like what I really liked is Maggie in the story wasn't just a romance. It felt like she was learning who she really wanted to be. Um and the Rocket sisterhood helping her uh bring that out in herself. And was that stories sort of the heart of the story, or did that evolve as you were writing this, or was that kind of the main target that you were going for?

SPEAKER_00 36:25

Well, it was kind of in the research and the story breaking itself, where um I talked to where I did talk to some Roquettes and people involved with that, where in just researching them and and seeing that the sisterhood came up so much that was such a huge thing. And you know, wanting her to have these, you know, these people that she's that she's becoming close friends with, you know, where even one of the characters

Premiere Night And Broadway Magic

SPEAKER_00 36:50

had never really had a friend, she couldn't trust anybody. She was trying to claw her way up, and then that this magical sisterhood, you know, brings brings everybody together and makes them be the best that they can be. So it kind of evolved that way where just in my research, seeing that come up over and over, it didn't it's it felt like we that was something we could not ignore or why we wouldn't want to, right? But it's almost that's why I love this movie because it's sort of a love story with it's you know, with Jenna Claire and Derek's characters, but then also with these girls who find this family together, and then she and she's finding you know what you what you can do when you have the support of people around you. And you know, I hate to say this, but like you know, a lot of times in Hollywood, women can be pretty awful to each other, and you you're very lucky if you can find people that really can support you and and can really do want the best for you. Like there's two other writers who are we call ourselves our work wives, and we're like this little we we just everyone knows we know we we talk every single day, and it's Nina Wyman and Tracy Andreen, and we just you know, we l we truly, truly, if I can't do a job, I want them to have it. If they can't have it, they want us me to have it. Like we talk every day. We are so we could never do this without each other. So that's what that's we we have that same sisterhood feeling that the Roquettes do, which is uh I why I think it was easier for me to write that because I get it.

SPEAKER_03 38:10

Yeah, you you kind of had that uh Janet's character. Um she was kind of um competitive at first, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:19

So yeah, and that's what then she let him in.

SPEAKER_03 38:22

Right.

SPEAKER_00 38:22

Yes, you gotta open that heart, open your heart and let them in and trust people. Yeah, very hard to trust people in this industry, truly. I mean, I've I've been burned before, and it and it's real, and it's hard to trust people in any kind of entertainment, whether it's roquettes or musicals or plays or screenwriting.

SPEAKER_05 38:38

So you really got you really got that. And that's that's one of the things I was curious about. Like I thought, no way are the roquettes like this nice to each other, you know. But it seems like they really were, and that's that really warms my heart to hear that. I really like that. It was wonderful. I wondered about that.

SPEAKER_00 38:53

They are amazing, they are amazing, and they're such they're athletes. I mean, what they do is like it's blows it blows my mind how how hard that is. When we went, we went to a show while I was writing and to when it was all sort of getting, you know, when we were working everything out, and I went, we went to see a show um while they were in season, and I was just I I had only been once many, many years before where I wasn't thinking about the tech, I wasn't thinking about all that stuff back then.

SPEAKER_02 39:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 39:17

Just just sitting there watching them, just thinking, my gosh, like it's it's amazing to me. I mean, they are in such, they are in such good shape. The fact what they do, they a lot of them are moms, they have families, they you know, they're they're amazing women.

SPEAKER_03 39:32

Yeah, wow. They truly are.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

Um I'm glad to hear that.

SPEAKER_03 39:36

So this film takes place during Christmas, but at its core, um, it's beautifully captures the excitement of being young and standing at a crossroads in life. Have you ever made a decision in your own life or career that felt as risky as Maggie's?

SPEAKER_00 39:54

Moving to LA, pretty pretty much, be it. That was that was um literally, I didn't know anybody in that the stand-up comedian guy that I met, you know, he couldn't really he couldn't really do anything for me. He was just a writer. Like he didn't he didn't have I had to, I really had to do it myself. And I so I moved up there, I got a job waiting tables at this restaurant in Beverly Hills and sort of you know figured stuff out. But that was a pretty big one, just moving to LA by myself. Like knowing no one out there, right? No, didn't know anybody, had a lot of crime going on outside my window, and it was a little scary. It was definitely I laugh about it now. Well, yeah, that you remember like you know, like the helicopter lights are like coming through.

SPEAKER_03 40:37

Oh my gosh.

How The Movie Got Greenlit

SPEAKER_00 40:40

And the suspect's probably right outside your door. So like it was just um um that was definitely a risk. And actually, I will say maybe the second one is moving to Connecticut and just believing that I could still keep working and have you know uh like have the same connection to the industry, but living out here, which um it worked out, it worked out good. So yeah, we're um that was a great decision, but it was that's another one that was hard.

SPEAKER_03 41:09

Interesting. All right, Renee.

SPEAKER_05 41:14

You know, I don't want to ask anything that's too personal, but I I found the dynamic between uh the main character and the mom very interesting. Um I was and I was wondering if that was something that you pulled from your own personal life experience, like where you maybe had I can see a parent going like, if you're gonna become a writer, why don't you do something, you know, get a job and doing this or doing something else. Is that something that was kind of in your life? You don't have to answer if that's what's too personal, but or is it a creative thing that you did?

SPEAKER_00 41:43

No, it was a creative thing because my mom, for you know, um my mom, she was not very expressive, and she's not doesn't say a lot, but what she always would say was that I could I would do it anything I put my mind to, that I would decide if I decided I was gonna do it, I was gonna do it. And so she told me that it didn't worry her in the least that I was moving to LA by myself to pursue this because she knew that like anytime I decided I would do something, I I would make it happen somehow. So um I was never discouraged. My dad, um, who's he he's he's passed, but he um he was a big theater nerd. Um he went to San Francisco State and has a mat he got a master's degree in theatrical lighting.

SPEAKER_02 42:29

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 42:30

And um never, but then again, again, that's that's the stage that we it's nothing we ever it didn't have any connection to me to Hollywood or anything like that because he just by the time I came around, um, he had already gone to Vietnam, um, came back and just needed to get a job and was given an opportunity as a longshoreman. So my dad is probably the only um Jewish longshoreman with a master's degree in theater. So that's always a good claim to fame. But I think he, I mean, he saw me at the very beginning and he was so excited. Like when he when I started first started writing working as an assistant, that's when he they were able to come visit before he got sick. And he was just he all he did wanted to do was talk to the lighting guys, and he was so excited about it. Like they've been they've all been really pretty supportive. Um, my son, this is funny. I'm I'm probably more I'm probably more cynical than my parents because I know what it is. Like they didn't know what I was getting into, but I do know it. And my son is very musical, he you know, he's very talented, and I don't want him to go with the you know what I mean, but I'm not saying he I'm not discouraging it, but I'm not encouraging it. But he's uh he's gonna start applying to colleges in you know this fall. So I'm like, you know, you can minor in any fun theater, music, whatever, but you you I I'm gonna need you to major in something else.

SPEAKER_04 43:52

We're we're in the same boat. I have a daughter who'll be applying this fall as well. Is that right? So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:56

Yeah, it's gonna be uh it's gonna be a crazy year, but um yeah. I he's like everyone keeps oh he's got the he's so talented, he's you know, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, blah, blah, blah. And I'm thinking, like, please don't move to LA. Please don't move to LA.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Well, it sounds like the creative genes run strong in your family for sure.

SPEAKER_00 44:13

Yes. He reminds me it's funny because my son plays guitar and he sings, and my that's what my dad used to do. He used to play guitar and sing in San Francisco in like, you know, in in nightclubs to make money and stuff like that. So it's definitely there, but I just know how hard it is and how much the industry is changing. Um when people ask me for advice on how to break in, I I literally cannot tell them. It's completely changed from when I started. There's nothing that I did exists. So um, you know, because my stuff involves fax machines and pagers and and a book and a book that would tell you the names of all the producers, and you'd have to go through the book and you'd have to fax recorded phones and it is yeah, it was completely changed.

SPEAKER_04 44:52

Getting our Netflix and DVDs in the mail. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

It's a oh no, it was way before that. Even before that, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, this is the 90s. There's nothing, there's no help. Oh, 90s.

SPEAKER_04 45:02

Wow, that's yeah.

SPEAKER_05 45:02

Yeah, I really like that that interaction between her mom and her. I just thought that was a lovely part of the story. I think I enjoyed that a lot.

SPEAKER_01 45:10

Yeah, and I agree, Renee. I think that the scene um in the restaurant when she finally tells her parents, when Maggie tells her parents, and the mom and the mom and dad are walking away, and there's this sort of smile on the mom's face when she turns around, and it's almost like she's proud of her for standing up for herself, you know, and it kind of reminds me, maybe related to what you said about your mom, how she always told you you could do whatever you wanted. Although, of course, in those times it was still That's right.

SPEAKER_00 45:35

And that's what I wanted to do, is that in those times, women were just not encouraged to go off and do what they wanted to do. They were they were expected to do certain things, you know, in society, especially if you're from a you know a family in Philadelphia that you know they have certain expectations. So that's um that's what I really liked about that dynamic was because that's when it was really starting to change, is exactly when that's why we I think I'm pretty sure that's why we picked that year, sort of that's when things were it wasn't quite the 60s yet, you know. It was just sort of it was just at that point where women were starting to think, you know what, I don't have to do it like this.

SPEAKER_05 46:12

And you had a you had a male version counterpoint too, with the son wanting to be a photographer, uh, graphic artist I forget what it's called, not graphic artist, but it's something like that. Photographer, yeah. Photojournalist or whatever. Photojournalist, I mean that was in the same vein, just you know, except this was the the uh the dad and and and the son. I thought that was interesting as well.

SPEAKER_03 46:32

Yeah. So did any of the characters surprise you as you were writing the story?

SPEAKER_00 46:40

Um I think Janet, you know, um the one who was sort of the heart, you know, tough, the tough one. Right. Um, because I I loved how it wasn't that that she surprised me in the writing. It was just that she is that the actress brought so much more to that role, so much depth to it. And you know, I'd I'd love to take credit for some of those moments. And maybe they were, maybe it was there a little on the page, but then some that you know, when you have when you cast the right people, like that whole cast brought so much more to it. And that's what you want, you know. You don't want to just none of these movies are just like, oh, this was a good movie because it was a good script. Like you have to have that magical thing where you have an awesome director, producer, right? You know, the cast. Everybody in that cast was fantastic. Um so it was I wouldn't say a surprise, but I just really enjoyed their finding these voices of who they were and and realizing how different each girl could actually be, but still be strong enough to be doing what they're doing. Because you can be, you don't have to be really strong, or any of these you can be a different person and all have the same goal and just come at it and looking at it in a different way. But like all the scenes of them in the restaurant, um my favorite because I just love the camaraderie and um those scenes. There was a lot, there was a lot more of those scenes that that we had to cut.

SPEAKER_03 47:59

Oh those are really good too.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

And I just love that because the focus on the friendships, which you know, we really saw I I feel like too in two Barcelona, you know, those movies.

SPEAKER_00 48:09

And yeah, I just love it. Yeah, I guess I guess I do that a lot. Like Field Day was one. That was a friendship. That was definitely a friend.

SPEAKER_01 48:16

Yeah, um the focus, and like you said, because women are so hard on each other, and it's just it's so great to see them on screen. And yeah, you might bicker, but nobody else can mess with my friend, you know what I mean? Like it's like that you want that build each other up, which I thought was was really well done in this movie.

unknown 48:33

Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 48:33

Well, that well, that's the the the those scenes were where they each kind of told their story. So I wish they were their background.

SPEAKER_00 48:41

Those are hard because you know, it's it's not easy to do backstory without it seeming like really, you know, just okay, here comes the exposition, here comes like you know, you know, like there's it's hard to get the that's the hardest challenge of any of these movies is to you know give a backstory without it being really boring or without depending on voiceover.

SPEAKER_03 49:01

Right. So were there scenes that ended up becoming more important than you thought they would?

SPEAKER_00 49:09

Um that's a hard that's hard for me to remember. I actually well, I actually think that the moment that they I think the moment they first saw the stage, the way that it was shot and the way that the with like you said, like the drone and all that. Um I it was a moment in the script where they, you know, they walk in and they gasp in there. So, you know, when they see the stage, they're just overwhelmed by it. And it was such a small moment in the stage direction, but it just just became such a beautiful moment where you could see in each character, specifically in each character, sort of their reaction to that moment and how and how much it meant to them. So, yeah, I think it um that another that's another example of it being elevated past what I wrote.

SPEAKER_04 49:53

I found it very curious. So, Hallmark took a chance with Jinna Claire and Derek as the two lead roles in this big huge film, two actors who'd never worked for Hallmark before, and obviously it turned out incredibly well. They absolutely killed it. Did you have any inclination as you were writing that they wouldn't be going, Hallmark wouldn't be going with some of their tried and true actors, and instead would be taking a chance on two brand new uh actors to the network?

SPEAKER_00 50:14

I am very rarely consulted for in front of that. Um I have um no, you know what? I I the only reason I would ever become a producer is to be able to do have a little bit more, not more say, but just be involved in that kind of a thing because it's fun. It's I I have on a few occasions been able to watch the audition tapes of you know for a lead role of one of my movies, and it's just so fun to watch like 10 different people do 10 different versions of the same stuff and see and it helps me. But um, yeah, no, I never I never thought about it, and actually I never really have anybody in my head unless I already know I'm writing for that person for sure, like Tyler, or you know what I mean, or something like that. That's the only time. Otherwise, they become people,

Drafts Notes And Staying On Set

SPEAKER_00 51:00

they become actual real people in my head that are not they're not uh connected to any actors in my mind.

unknown 51:06

Right.

SPEAKER_00 51:08

So sometimes you know who is gonna be in it before you write, or well, I did with you know with Ashley and Allie too, you know, with the Barcelona. Oh, right, right, right, with the two Barcelona. I knew it was Tyler for um The Chiefs and um not that I can't remember more much many more than that, honestly. Like I think or or or sometimes you'll get a cast before you've written the next, like I'll do like a final draft for production sometimes, you know, where you're doing like last-minute things. Oh, we can't shoot here, it needs to be here, so we need to change, you know, change it to reflect the new location, all that kind of stuff. Um, and then sometimes I'll know who the actor is by that time. So every so often I can kind of go back in and tweak if I think there's something that that person would be really good at, or but you know, um, I don't always get that opportunity. And and you know what, the Hallmark actors are so good, they can pretty much they just make it work. I don't I never I never really worry about it, and I don't think there's anybody I've that where I've seen the cast and went like, ugh, that's I don't think that's ever happened.

SPEAKER_01 52:11

Well, that's a good thing. Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 52:14

They have such talented, no, not at all.

SPEAKER_01 52:16

They can work with. That's great. Well, after the movie came out, was there a compliment or reaction from someone that really stuck with you? Like a fan, a rocket, well, a family movie.

SPEAKER_00 52:27

Yeah, it was Kristen Jenowith, actually. Oh, because she we there they they showed the movie at you know, in in Radio City, and she before but she so basically she said, like, you know, it was so wonderful and I loved it so much, and I cried and all that. And that was to me just because I just love her. So that was my Starstruck. Oh, that was my little Starstruck moment for that night. Um, you know, when people come it's it's very weird, but when I get compliments, like I I love them and they're wonderful and I appreciate them, but like um if I ever really believed all the things people say about me, I would be probably not even working anymore because I wouldn't think I needed to try so hard, you know. Like I don't I still treat every job like it's my last or first. Like, yeah, I try and um well more, probably like my first. I don't I don't want it to be my last. I I never, you know, I try not to rest on my laurels at all, and uh and I would never phone in anything. So um I'd love to get the compliments in. As a writer, of course, we're all neurotic, so we only remember the negative reviews. Yeah. Yeah. Even for that, I don't I don't really remember anything super negative. I don't. I mean, it was just um you know, I I think that I would have loved it if the extended version had aired the first the first night. I think it would have it's a better movie that way, the way it is now. But that that's not even possible with the way advertising works and the time slots and all that stuff. But they did it again, they did it right away, they had the extended version. Um but yeah, so I mean we so that the re my hope that's a very long answer to me saying I if somebody really amazing said that something really nice, I probably already forgot it because oh well Kristen Channel, that's a pretty big deal.

SPEAKER_01 54:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:16

That's a good but then I tried to then I tried to message her about something once and she didn't even answer, so she didn't really know, like is it's not like you know what I just remember it wasn't personal, she was just probably busy, she didn't have time to answer.

SPEAKER_03 54:30

Yeah, all right. So you've written um uh movie sets and all kinds of places, errors and and time periods. Is there a location or like an era or Christmas tradition that you still haven't um explored but would want to?

SPEAKER_00 54:47

There are a lot of locations I want to do. Yeah, there are. Um I want to do Scotland. Oh this is just places I want to go, by the way. Um, I really wanted to do the River Cruise movie. I I didn't know they already have these in development. And I went in, I'm like, you guys, uh look, I'm gonna do it. Oh, the love on the Danube? I'm like, yeah, no, we already have two of those.

SPEAKER_04 55:11

Tracy did pretty good with that one. Yeah, she did. She did. I and that's the thing.

SPEAKER_00 55:14

Like, you know, I guess that's if anyone else was gonna do it, it needed to be traced. So and hers is awesome. She did a great job with it. So um, I the look, I moved to New England because I'm so enamored with the whole vibe of Connecticut and New England, and I just love Christmas in I love where I am. I mean, right it's it feels like I really do feel like I live in kind of this perpetual Hallmark movie, especially in the fall and the winter. And so I don't feel like kind of that when I lived in LA, all I wanted to do was get out and go somewhere that was cute and walkable and had colonials and had felt like felt like a Hallmark movie. And now I don't feel that anymore. So now I want to go farther. So um I would love to do, like I said, like Scotland, Switzerland, um, which I don't know if they've done. This is a problem. Sometimes I get a really good idea and then I look it up, and it turns out, oh yeah, they already they've done it. I can't watch everything, you know. It just doesn't right. You guys are there, you guys know way more about all these movies than I ever would. And I some I have a couple, there's a couple podcasters that I know that are encyclopedic with their knowledge, and I just would I would just text them like, hey, did we ever do how can we do this?

SPEAKER_01 56:24

Do we ever do this? Yeah, yeah, that's rich.

SPEAKER_00 56:27

Yeah, definitely. I'm gonna use I know I know I know which too. Yeah, I'm gonna talk about, but uh you know, I mean I set I set two of my movies where I live, but even though they were they I they were set in my town now, but then they were filmed in Canada, but like it still said the name of the town, so I thought that was kind of fun. Yeah, that's cool. We reverse engineered a Christmas festival because I put one in the script, only because our town doesn't have one, and it's it worked. I was like an evil genius. I'm like, watch, this is they're gonna I'm gonna put a festival in, and then they're gonna feel like they should do one, and they did. Oh, that's so cool!

SPEAKER_01 57:01

So it's good, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 57:02

I always liked a Christmas festival and a Christmas tea uh tree shopping scene. I would love those.

SPEAKER_00 57:08

I do love the Christmas with the twinkly lights, and you know, this that's the thing. So our challenge for Christmas is always, and it was easier on this movie because it was stuff that no one has it wasn't kind of the usual, it was all new, really. Um, and but the challenge for Christmas is really just doing the kind of this the those things we all want to see in a Hallmark movie, but try and find a different way to do it.

SPEAKER_02 57:29

Right.

unknown 57:29

Right.

SPEAKER_00 57:30

That is that is the challenge, but that that comes from the characters, that comes from these people that now exist. Like, how is this person gonna do it differently?

SPEAKER_02 57:37

Right.

SPEAKER_01 57:38

So what is something that people almost never ask you about a holiday spectacular that you wish they would?

SPEAKER_00 57:50

Um that's a really good question. I don't have it. I don't even know. That's a really good something you want people to know that um no, because I actually um I you because we kind of already talked about it, which so you didn't ask it, but I do like to tell people with that but you didn't ask it, but I like to tell people kind of how it came about because I want, you know, like like because I just like the idea that we just sort of you know, just kind of the random family connection that got made this huge thing happen. That just was just really that's not a story we tell that I'm able to tell a lot because you know it hasn't come up. So I I would so that would have been my answer, but I already told you to you, so well, that's all right. That works.

SPEAKER_03 58:32

All right, so we're gonna do some rapid questions here, right?

SPEAKER_00 58:36

All right, let's do it. This is literally the most nerve-wracking part of any interview for me. I swear to God. Hopefully, these they're not they're not hard.

SPEAKER_03 58:43

They're not.

SPEAKER_04 58:44

I have no idea what they're gonna say either, Julie. So here we go.

SPEAKER_03 58:46

All right, so here we go. You ready? Yes. Eggnog, yes, please, or ooh, no way.

SPEAKER_00 58:53

Do I get to answer? Yes, go ahead. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. A thousand times, yes. Renee Rich.

Sisterhood As The Story’s Heart

SPEAKER_04 59:00

Uh this one actually Oh, Rich, go ahead. Uh yes, please, but I think I know what Renee's gonna say since it was a movie that we covered of yours, Julie.

SPEAKER_05 59:06

So Renee? Oh, me? Yeah. Well, I'm not gonna ask about a movie. I'm gonna ask something that Rich mentioned to me. Is that is there a thing where you mention or have ranch dressing be in every movie? This is not mine, this is Rich's question, but I've taken it from him.

SPEAKER_00 59:26

Um, did you must have seen my post the other day about the uh World Cup? Did you see it?

SPEAKER_02 59:32

I did not, but maybe Rich did.

SPEAKER_00 59:34

I yes, I think I've well, I just I have a thing. I love ranch dressing and I hate bad ranch dressing, and I've put it in, it just sort of happened and then it became a thing. So I I think I mentioned it in probably like four or five movies about ranch dressing. And now just only because now it's like a thing, it's like an Easter egg. Now you have to do it. Yeah. There's probably 10 people on the wood in the world that know that, that that's a thing. But um, but I was I just posted the other day because all these um I was just in Boston yesterday because I wanted to um we went to see Le Miz, and then when I wanted to hang out with Scottish soccer fans, my family and I, we hung out with like the Scots, and it was amazing, it was so fun. Um, but apparently they're all into ranch dressing because the Europeans don't have it. So there was a whole story about how um they're trying to smuggle ranch dressing back into their countries, and that you know the TSA is telling them that's a liquid and you can't. And I thought I posted that I've never I've never felt more connected to you know the world as I do with this. I take it very seriously. I don't know why.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:34

That's so funny.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:35

So Renee, eggnog, yes or no?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:37

Uh or ooh, no way.

SPEAKER_05 1:00:41

I'm kind of in be in the middle of the road. I mean, I can take it or leave it, honestly.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:47

Okay, I'll drink it.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:48

You know, I want a respectful time, but Julie, so the third movie we ever covered was Finding Santa. And in that movie, they served hot, they served hot eggnog, and Renee called out as like, whoa, eggnog's not supposed to be served. Yeah. Hot right off of the stove.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:00

I don't that's right. I don't remember what happened there with that. I'm sure I must have seen a recipe where it was heated up how it was done. Renee, can I encourage you to try the Kirkland uh boozy eggnog next to the game? I was just gonna say spiked eggnog. I'm gonna write it down right now. There you go. Yeah, that's a great that's stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:24

We get that. Got it. I'm writing it down so I don't forget it. We do get that.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:28

We every not gonna lie.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:30

All right, so next question real tree or artificial tree? Julie. Well, oh my gosh. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:38

Okay, it's the answer is real, but we're Jewish. So I mean it's I'm gonna tell you. Oh, I'm the answer is real tree. During COVID, we me and my husband lost our minds and said, we're gonna get a Christmas tree because you know what? It's we just everyone bought one weird thing during COVID, and that was ours. And we tried it, we bought a tree and we tried to put it up, and we had uh every single thing that could go wrong where it was clear that God was like, nope, this is not God, you know, God with the hammer of of God said absolutely not. Oh we we took it out of the box and it was back in the box and going back to the place within two hours of that attempt. So I love I love a Christmas tree. I love a real Christmas tree. I go to I I decorate my friends' trees, I go and hang out with my friends and their trees. I love Christmas more than anybody, but but having an actual tree in our house was apparently the line that we could not cross. That was that was it, yeah. I have I have stockings, I have ornaments, I have a ladder of ornaments now. It's like a vintage ladder, and I put all my ornaments on the ladder. I have all the other things, but a tree, no, no, that was not gonna happen. But I love them. So real.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:46

All right, what about you, Rich?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:48

Uh, it used to be a real tree, but is the family's collected some really nice ornaments throughout the year? We're afraid they're gonna break on sometimes on the real tree. So now we're an artificial tree, so all those ornaments are displayed but safe, and we don't worry about them following. So it's been a little bit of both throughout the years.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:03

All right, Renee?

SPEAKER_05 1:03:04

Yeah, I I like a natural tree in theory, but just for ease and convenience. Yes. Uh, and I used to live in a place where they had a vaulted ceiling in the living room. And Costco has like this eight-foot or ten-foot, you know, tree. I always that was my dream to have just by the window a giant tree. So I like an artificial tree just because it's easy.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:26

You can get that spray. That's what we do. We get the garland that's real now, like that just I put it in the day. I have those little sticks. I'm good. I'm happy. It smells like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:34

Yeah, we like the we like the pine-scented cantles. Candles cantles. Cantles. Do I know how to speak? The pine scented candles behind me somewhere. Yeah. Candles, yeah. We we light those. We're artificial trees all the way.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:46

And pre-lit, too.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:48

And pre-lit, yeah. I'm not stringing anymore.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:52

All right. So classic Christmas carols or modern holiday songs.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:58

Should I go? Yeah. Um, we like the classics with the coal, like the knacking coal and all that stuff. That is what that is what we prefer. And that's what's on the the and that's why I like like Hallmark Radio tends to lean toward those old standards. The classics. Rich?

SPEAKER_04 1:04:16

Yeah, I'm I'm I'm with you, the classics. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:18

Renee? There's a Hallmark radio. There is on XM every year. They do Hallmark uh Christmas. I I did not know that. Hallmark and all the Hallmark actors say, Hi, this is Jenna Claire Mason, and this is my favorite Christmas song.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:32

I did not know this. I didn't know that either. A reason to subscribe to XM at least for a month or two.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:38

It's a pretty good, yeah, they do a pretty good job. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:40

And they do a they do a yacht rock Christmas now too, but Renee.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:43

Oh, they do? Yeah, Christmas. My family literally had a yacht rock uh cover band show right now across the world.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:51

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:51

I'm embarrassed to say this. What was the question? Oh, that's all right. Classic Christmas carols or modern holiday songs.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:58

Renee, you and I are just I'm embarrassed. That's friends.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:04

That's okay. And you know, my favorite song, it's it's the most wonderful time of year. I just love it. I get goosebumps, I get choked up. I just love it. Yeah. Classic all the way.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:15

All right.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:15

All right. Open Christmas pres open presents on Christmas Eve or Christmas morning. Well, Julie, never mind.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:22

No, no, don't jump to conclusions. Do you do? Okay. Okay, sorry. I'm telling you, we have everything except the tree. Except the tree. Oh, okay, okay. I'm sorry. That's why we like, and we're both Jewish. That's what's so funny. Like the we just love Christmas. We we have everything but the tree. So Santa, and now my son's 17, so like, you know, we're it's yeah, it's a little bit different. But Santa, we have stockings, and Santa does come and he eats his bites of cookie, and the reindeer have their carrots, and there are there are presents in the morning from Santa. And uh we spend Christmas Eve generally with other.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:00

like out like you know with friends or whatever you know where there's real a real tree or something yeah you gather around someone else's tree someone else's tree on Christmas

Holiday Traditions And Rapid Questions

SPEAKER_01 1:06:10

eve how much you rich yeah it's Christmas morning for our family yeah Renee so I come from a Hispanic family and we would go into Mexico because I was born here we would go into Mexico and the whole family would travel and they would meet so we would open a Christmas Eve at midnight because we would everybody would stay up till four or five six in the morning.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:32

Yeah and then you'd you'd you'd get up at 12 1 or 2 o'clock and have tamales and menudo or whatever. Oh there you go that works it was Christmas Eve because the the kids weren't patient enough to wait till the morning's like no way. Right right for me and I like that Christmas Eve at midnight.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:51

Yeah right here's the last one ugly Christmas sweater wear it or quietly judge it wear it I have a whole collection same awesome I I have an ugly Hanukkah sweater I have an ugly Christmas sweater um yeah I like an I like an ugly Christmas sweater party yes me too you know that sort of I mean we all do that in all of our scripts now too like that that's not you know that's that's kind of a go-to now but I do love it the ugly Christmas sweater I mean I've been I've been wearing a sweater and someone's like oh do you wear your ugly Christmas sweater and I'm like no I'm this one is just a normal Christmas mine thank you very much usually it's one of our kids usually is one of the kids but it's one of them it's one of them Beverly I just want to you know I'll go all out I don't care what about you Rich Yeah I guess I'd say I'd admire them uh from uh from a distance but I do want to go to an ugly sweater party like I see in so many a Hallmark movie I'm dying to go to one I don't like sweaters generally speaking I'm I'm too hot oh yeah so I don't like wearing a sweater uh but if I would wear one if there was an occasion but I'm in Southern California I mean yeah our Christmas is 70 was 75 degrees when I moved Renee Christmas Christmas I lived in Orange County all my life like I could not experience Christmas you know with actual snow or something like that. I don't know what happened my husband grew up in Woodland Hills so he's like a total he's an LA guy yeah I like them but I don't wear them. Hey Renee you gotta start a uh ugly shirt t-shirt there you go tradition there that's that's a good idea thank you all right and look Julie you can you can write one now you can write about ugly shirt in California I'm actually picturing Renee like putting ornaments in his beard and lights oh yeah and just sort of working like that I think that would be cool that would that's cool yeah I might do that they won't let me do a Southern California they won't let me do like hot weather Christmas they just don't oh they won't like an Australian Christmas you know no because no everyone wants the Hallmark Christmas everybody wants that look you know and I just think I if they do it it's it's gonna have to be really a really really good reason you know like it has to be like a big I've pitched I've pitched a lot a bunch of times and this just doesn't ever really work out I'm sure there's some somebody's done it but generally they would like rather have it be you know Christmas have the feel the snow the yeah the cold the sweaters yeah yeah that that's okay all right well um we have taken up a lot of your time Julie so thank you very much for being like no one's here it's fine it's fine yeah your whole family you're like woo let's go for another drink I'll watch I I wonder if it's blasphemy to say this but I'm I'm gonna go watch a K drama now that I have that TV device now that you I really love them that's so funny. I don't know if you guys have gotten into them you may not have time but they're they're they're actually great if you've ever watched no we haven't yet oh my god they're fantastic they're like hi hi high budget hallmark movies that last 16 hours oh oh my gosh I'm watching the attorney the amazing attorney woo or something like that see Renee knows that was a lot more in Spanish it's funny yeah it's a good starter one actually Renee yeah yeah wow anyway all right Rich and Renee do you have any closing thoughts for Julie thank you for doing this it's such a pleasure to meet you totally my pleasure I love I love that you guys still think about this movie

What’s Next And Where To Follow

SPEAKER_00 1:10:40

and and and love it and it makes it just really makes me happy thank you.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:43

Yeah thank you for writing such an amazing movie I I was telling before you logged on Julie and everybody else you know I saw the Rockettes for the first time just this past December and I literally had waited to watch the movie my wife and I knew we were going to go to New York eventually for Christmas and it turns out she was there on business so I literally had waited all these years to watch it watched it on my way to New York. Oh really I saw the Rockets like two days later oh my gosh that's really cool that is amazing. I mean thank you for you and every John Punch everybody for just making just an incredible movie.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:11

It is so darn good it was really was now do you have any upcoming projects that you can tease or mention at this time I can I I did uh I did some work on a Christmas movie for this coming season. Oh um but I probably can't mention it yet I have a couple non-Christmas things that I'm working on that I can't probably can't mention yet anymore. Yeah no I've got nothing.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:39

Nothing well hey the fact that we know something is coming at Christmas is good is good enough for me.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:45

Yes that's very exciting I think they're I actually think it's starting to shoot uh I think it'll you may see something about it in the next couple weeks let's put it that way because I think they're starting soon but um I just finished sort of my last bit on it. So oh wow exciting very cool very cool I promise you it's yeah you will you'll if you pay any attention to that kind of stuff it'll you'll you'll see what I was talking about. And then you can ask me a follow-up question later like definitely all right so where can our listeners keep up with you do you have a website social media right now it would just be Instagram so it's Julie underscore Sherman underscore wolf I'm a non um I'm not a regular poster but I try I'm trying more trying harder you know yeah do more Julie you're not doing it. I feel pressure I feel too much pressure to do to to do that and I keep thinking well no one I can't be an influencer who what are they going to say like oh here's what Julie here's the the the twisty she puts in her hair when she crawls downstairs to sit at her desk like what am I selling here's my you know like I'm I'm wearing yoga pants and I have my hair in a bun and that's you know that's that's the fabulous life that I'm selling would you like to pay me would you like to collab?

SPEAKER_01 1:13:05

Would you like to collab? Yeah that's an be an influencer yeah all right well this this was so much fun thank thank you everybody for joining us and sharing your stories until next time cheers my glasses empty oh that's good thank you